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Knife Self Defense – It aint gotta be pretty

February 17, 2009 | Author: Matthew | Filed under: How-To,Martial Arts,Opinion,Techniques,Tips and Tricks,karate,modern arts,self defense

I’m not confident in my ability to defend myself against a knife. I’m not. Knives are small, quick, furious weapons that can shred you up in a heartbeat. Worst of all, a knife is formidable even in the hands of an unskilled attacker.

If you’ve never seen a knife attack at full speed (or even if you have), check out the following video. The weird guy in the ski mask sees it coming, and still winds up in an unpleasant situation:

That’s against some average dude with a fairly even keeled disposition. Imagine if you encountered someone who is good with a blade. Like this individual:

The credit card trick is interesting, but it’s his knife speed that is both impressive and frightening (note: I found this video initially at Low Tech Combat).

A couple of years ago, my gut reaction was to ignore these kinds of videos because they were simply too intimidating. It’s difficult to imagine a successful defense against such deadly assaults. I told myself that I would ‘deal with it later’, or that my basic scenario knowledge was enough to get me by. Eventually I realized though that I would have to take knife self defense extremely seriously or I might as well not even study martial arts for combat purposes.

So now that you scared us Matt, how about some solutions!?

Don’t worry, this isn’t all scare tactics (I promise). I’ve found some great concepts that I think maximize a citizen’s potential for self defense. The truth is, defense against a knife is rarely pretty and clean; but perhaps by adopting some good practices we can increase the odds of survival.

Mind, Then Matter

Before I dive into videos or techniques, I need to harp on something quick. The mind is the greatest tool for avoiding knife conflict (or conflict in general). Using good judgment and maintaining a constant vigil for bad situations can be the best defense against assault. Furthermore, keeping escape as our #1 priority can increase our chances of survival, even if things do move to a fight.

But, assuming a situation does escalate to conflict, we need to investigate defensive concepts.

Bursting

One of my absolute favorite knife self defense concepts comes from Krav Maga. Now, I know what you’re thinking: “is this traditional karate guy hyping up Israeli military tactics? Where’s the Samurai s*** Mr. Ikigai?”

It’s true, I really like Krav Maga’s knife work. Krav has achieved a level of effectiveness born from sheer practicality and necessity (as most good techniques do). The Israelis really need to know how to take down a knife attacker, so they worked on it and created, amongst other things, bursting.

What is bursting exactly? I’ll let Human Weapon explain:

The critical concept here is that the block and strike occur simultaneously. There is no room for error. If the block comes even a moment before the strike, the attacker can recoil and stab again. *Remember how quick the knifer in the first video struck the man in the ski mask.*

Furthermore, trying to control the knife arm/wrist without first striking your opponent makes for a lesson in futility. The knife is coming in at unusual angles and is thrusting and recoiling at a remarkable pace, even for attackers with average speed. Getting a grip on the knife wrist can be like trying to catch a wasp with your bare hand – you end up missing or getting stung.

The ‘burst’ allows for broad safety moves (like blocking into the forearm) while delivering a punishing blow to vital areas.

When Natural Reaction Kicks In

Bursting is a great tactic, but sometimes we are taken by surprise and don’t have the chance to mount a balanced, effective burst. In that case, our body’s natural instinct is to “get outta the way!”. For situations like that, especially when a stab is coming toward the stomach (like the one that felled our masked hero in the first video), this next video could prove valuable.

When watching this, try to mentally incorporate bursting into the instructor’s explanations. His defense is good, but he could benefit from utilizing lightning quick strikes to the face and vital regions.

A skilled (or just clever) knife wielder will probably stab you before you see it coming. That’s the bad news. The good news is, if your spidey senses are alert the way they should be, you’ll probably see him eyeballing you or giving out a weird vibe. Unless you’re being targeted by a really skilled killer, there will hopefully be a moment’s notice of danger.

Scenario Thinking

Although I’ve mostly discussed general concepts like bursting and reactionary movement, scenario training is still valuable. The caveat is intent. Unfortunately many of us (**raises hand**) spent time discussing the intriguing theory behind scenario defense and not actually trying to perform against a non compliant attacker.

For scenarios, I like this guy’s approach:

A little bit scary right? That’s a good thing. He uses his persona to deter possible attackers. “Maybe i’ll wait for an easier target”, they might think.

Things To Avoid

If it looks pretty, be wary. I know, that’s a totally bogus generalization. Level of expertise is as important as the technique itself. But it’s been my personal experience that highly conceptualized disarms don’t work on an extremely tense and agitated attacker looking to stab you repeatedly.

Some examples of things I don’t see panning out in the ‘real world’ are as follows:

We can readily see severe differences in the behavior of the attacker than what would normally happen with an aggressive, determined knifer. Unfortunately, some of this is trained compliance that can lead to trouble in the long run.

In my own training I’ve tried to integrate good concepts of my core style (karate) with realistic training practices done by other styles. Even still, knife defense concerns me, and will continue to do so for a very long time.

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This entry was posted on Tuesday, February 17th, 2009 and is filed under How-To, Martial Arts, Opinion, Techniques, Tips and Tricks, karate, modern arts, self defense. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.

James

An ordinary individual is exposed to danger at many times in his lifetime. The everyday travel to the workplace can also present many potential hazards. Not surprisingly, there are people who undergo classes and training to learn the means to defend themselves. There are many systems of self-defense and martial arts in which a person can learn to deter bodily assault. I'm learning Krav Maga now and I must say that it is a good form of self defense...
selfdefenseknives

Great information on self defense. very practical.
Brandon

exactly (in response to all of the above)
Massimo Gaetani

I like as usual the way you developed this post. Interesting and practical the usage of the marker pen in video 1. Scary Video 2, interesting 3 and 4: the video 5 is probably a easier situation to handle as you start from a static situation rather than a dynamic one. The Aikido Video are alway run this way and people always punch and stab in a fully committed trust... do they?

The main problem with knife attack is that, often, the attacker will not draw the knife and show it around: if he does it's like he might want to scare you, perhaps with the intent of robbin you. In many cases somebody might just draw the knife, while fighting, and simply stab you or cut you in the process: and in these cases people get injured or killed without having concious knowledge of that happening.
Matthew

Eric - Please forgive my neglect of the triple spin kick. Certainly that is an ultimate technique. Of course, we should also mention the chi blast that will render the attacker unconscious from 20 feet away.

Mike: I appreciate your Shihan's non-romanticized approach to knife practice. I think that's very important.

Rick: Thank you very much for bringing an aikido perspective! I am a big fan of aikido, but like you said, it's important to differentiate the spiritual, training aspects from the hardline self defense. It's neat to see connections between seemingly distant arts like aikido and krav maga.

John: Critical distance - great addition to the conversation. I've always thought of distancing and timing as greater than any particular technique, and that makes your viewpoint resonate for me.

Of course, we do have to consider the fact that we might not have the luxury of establishing critical distance in public venues out of spacial necessity or surprise. Bars, atms, or even pharmacies (which happened last week in my neighborhood!) can all lead to situations where distance is closed without your control. At those times, the skills shown above are very useful.

Thanks again to everyone for pondering and commenting on this topic. I'm in Colorado at the moment, but will be back later this week.
Rick Matz

I want to expand on something I wrote previously:

Martial arts study is many things: self defense, sport, and budo study. While these areas overlap, they’re not the same thing. I think it’s a good idea to have a clear idea of what you are studying.

When I trained in aikido, practicing our techniques on the mat for the study of budo, I can’t for a second think that Kushida Sensei would recommend what we were specifically doing as a response to a knife attack in the street. You can’t evade the bad guy forever. In fact, I know of one aikido student who got confronted with a knife in a parking lot and tried to evade and grab. He got stabbed in the leg. His attacker got so shook up that he ran away! As the character Buddha Hat in Clockers said, using a knife on someone is really personal.

Almost all of the techniques we practice in aikido began with shite (“the doer”) striking uke (“the receiver”) in the face as the uke began his attack. Kushida called this a distraction. He also said that if you made the distraction strong enough, you might not need to complete a technique. Looking at these videos, I think that the “distraction” is very much the same thing as “bursting.”

Also, in my present study of taijiquan, I see many instances of simultaneous attack and defense. Again, I think the same idea of bursting is present. I found it interesting that in all the videos presented, the ones that most align with my idea of how taijiquan would be applied in real life are the Krav Maga vids.

I found this clip on the Rum Soaked Fist forum. It’s from the movie The Hunted, that reportedly depicts knife fighting in a realistic way. I think there might be some lessons to take away from this.

http://rumsoakedfist.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&...
John W. Zimmer

I have a different perspective - I think knife fighting is a lot like fighting a baseball bat or no weapon. I would use critical distance, rear - side, snap kicks and shy away from blocking techniques as they would work no better than they do in regular fighting. I generally fight the same unless a guy has a gun (then I am hoping to get away unless the guy is dumb enough to stand inside my distance).

I like you would not like to be fighting next to someone and try to depend on a quick strike to deflect the stab... that is a losing proposition because if a fighters is well trained in initial movement (like Bruce Lee/Joe Lewis) the first one to strike within the critical distance (with fist, knife or whatever) will get the first strike in.

That being said I did enjoy the krav maga knife to the throat defense (assuming you let the guy do that already) - it look like a workable defense.

Another good thought provoking post!
Rick Matz

I pointed a couple of friends to this post, and we began discussing training as budo, sport, or self defense. They overlap a great deal, but are certainly different things.

When I studied aikido, the techniques we practiced on the mat were done in pursuit of our budo training. I could never see our teacher advocating what was depicted above as a realistic response in a self defense situation.

I found that the Krav Maga resonated the most with my understanding of the taijiquan I am studying these days.
Mike Oliveri

Love that Carey video! Makes me laugh every time.

We worked a little bit of knife defense at my dojo. Our instructor, Shihan Joseph Walker, also teaches Haganah, which incorporates a lot of krav maga. It was interesting stuff, but it was pretty clear if you're up against a determined and/or skilled attacker you're in trouble.

One person also asked "What do you do if someone comes at you stabbing straight for your gut?" Shihan's reply was "Bleed." We did discuss and try a few things, but as mentioned above, that pumping thing is trouble.
Black Belt Mama

These comments are hysterical. Oh my God. The nunchaku thing and Texas Ranger. Oh, my stomach hurts from laughing.
Eric M

How can you write an article on knife defense and not include any references to Chuck Norris? He always uses the ultimate knife disarm technique in Walker, Texas Ranger. Perfectly done 540 degree jumping spin kicks from across the room. Works every time!
Rick Matz

Now the nunchaku, that's a weapon. I worked with one for years. I am convinced that if I were attacked and I had a nunchaku, I could simply hand it over to my attacker and watch him beat himself to death.

I know another guy who tried to achieve some competency with the three sectional staff (triple sticks). I was watching him practice twirling them vertically, when first one end, then the other hit him in forehead and knocked him out briefly.
Adam @ Low Tech Combat

LOL, that Jim Carey vid was great! Ive never seen it before.

Elias, cheers for the info regarding 'bursting'. I can imagine it could work if you maintain that forward momentum and gain control of the knife arm.

One more little thing. Yes the knife is dangerous, but you always have a chance. It is important to have a healthy respect for it but don't be crippled by fear of it.
Matthew

BBM: Sure thing. We got into it a little bit this week but there is certainly room for more training.

Rick: Hmm, hadn't heard of that one. I'll look into it. Thanks for the tipoff.
Rick Matz

There is a movie which starred Peter Coyoter, know as A Grand Arte, or also Exposure, which depicts knife fighting with all it's visceral grittiness. It's well worth renting.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Grande_Arte
Black Belt Mama

Remember when I was hugely pregnant and I came to class requesting knife self defense scenarios? Ah, good times. It's been a while, so when I get back to class, let's review. Please. Even reading about knife self defense gets my stomach doing flips. It is very intimidating and scary because one screw-up and you're done.
Matthew

Great input guys! I agree with both of your analyses. Like I said I'm no master on the subject and I've found very few cure-all tactics, even within the videos I've provided.

Elias: Thanks for going into more detail about bursting. I've found that continuing through to control the knife wrist after a burst is general a sound idea as it gives you just enough time to strike again without being punctured. Love the Jim Carey video by the way - that was actually my profile video for the first Convocation of Combat Arts!

As for the surprise attack, you're right - there are definite weaknesses there. I thought I'd include it for the sake of 'ohh sh**' scenarios where it just kinda happens.

Adam: The statistics in the US are quite similar, which is why this is such a concern for me. It's great that you get to train with Mr. Floro - clearly he is a specialist and could provide excellent training.

Bursting definitely includes risk. Like I said, there is no room for error. If you don't land a good strike, the attacker can indeed pump stabs. Your observation about the third video is definitely correct though.
Elias

The guy in the second video was pretty badass.

In Krav, we learn the "general solution", which is essentially a thrust kick to the chest or chin, depending on your ability, and timing and distance, of course.

The burst is more of a secondary option, really, for when the opponent has slipped through your awareness, and is too close. The guys from Human weapon may have gone through it, but the burst technique wasn't exactly complete. The idea is to keep moving forward, with the blocking arm held out strong, to sort of control the knife arm (basically, make it hard for the opponent to recoil), whilst counterattacking.

The third one with the surprise attack isn't too good in my opinion; the risk is too great to redirect the knife right into your body, and as Adam said, it only works with one big stab. I'd prefer to use something like a burst to defend against an attack like that.

The idea behind one hand grabbing the wrist is that you do it really fast, with an explosive movement, hopefully executing the first part of the defense before your opponent can react, but I'm not keen on testing that theory out at the moment...

That's all I can comment on with a reasonable degree of credibility.

I think that the aikido defenses could actually work, provided that the practitioners drilled and practised against opponents that are useing 'committed' attacks. I don't think that the guy in the first video would have sore forearms after that video, whereas I have sore forerarms for days, from executing the block after every training session where we do 360 defense/bursting.

Oh, like you said, Awareness is really your first weapon.

Best knife defense video I've seen btw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpaoxgbUh9c

Knives are scary.

A great post as usual Matt =D
Adam @ Low Tech Combat

Very well put post. Real knife attacks are a very scary thing. A knife doesn't run out of bullets and it can be re-used over and over again.

From the research ive done, if you live in Australia or the UK, the most likely weapon you will face is the knife. In the US, it is a firearm, followed by a knife. So knife practise should be a high priority.

I have some thoughts to offer regarding a couple of the videos.

Firstly, the second video with the credit card is done by Ray Floro. He is known around the world as a real authority on edged weapon defense. Luckily, I live near him and train with him one on one whenever I can. His stuff is easily the best I have ever seen anywhere. At the very least, keep an ear out for him or even better, go check out his site or blog or get his awesome DVD collection. I hope it is ok that I mention that here?

Secondly, I think 'bursting' is an ok tactic. However, from what I can see in the short video, you leave it open for the knife wielder to attack you again. It would be risky to assume that the one counter will always stop an attacker. It may not happen that way. Your strike may glance off the target or you may be slightly unbalanced as you counter which will limit the effectiveness of the strike. The main problem is you lose control of the knife and the attacker, giving them the option to come at you again...

Thirdly, there is one major problem with the 'surprise knife attacker' video. It will only work if the attacker goes for one big stab. It will not work if the attacker tries to 'pump' that knife into your body 10 times in one second. The counter is too slow. Unfortunately, 'pumping' is the most dangerous way to use a knife in my opinion. Ray Floro has a simple technique he calls the 'latch' which prevents the attacker pulling the arm back to pump it into to you. Unfortunately, there is no video of it on the net that I know of at the moment...

The final Krav Maga video with the knife against the throat would be fine with one little modification. He begins his counter by holding the knife wielding wrist with just one hand. One against one is a strength contest. If he is stronger than you, you lose. All you have to do to make it much better is to use both hands to grab that one knife wielding wrist. At least initially. Two against one is much better.

Well, ive gone on for long enough. Great post, knife defense is a very important topic as they are a very common, dangerous and easy to acquire weapon.

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